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Belgian Criminals

This is a discussion on Belgian Criminals within the Politics forums, part of the General category; Why does the Poop, sorry Pope think he is in a position to criticize Belgian police who are just doing ...

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    Senior Member choSenfroZen's Avatar
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    Default Belgian Criminals

    Why does the Poop, sorry Pope think he is in a position to criticize Belgian police who are just doing their jobs, protecting Belgian children from Belgian perverts.

    I really want the United Nations to kick down the Vatican doors, and start protecting the world's kids from this worldwide collection of black robed perverts.
    " Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? "
    - Epicurus

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    Default Re: Belgian Criminals

    Quote Originally Posted by choSenfroZen View Post
    Why does the Poop, sorry Pope think he is in a position to criticize Belgian police who are just doing their jobs, protecting Belgian children from Belgian perverts.
    Because it's so out of place.

    With Cardinal Brady still running around free in Ireland and Cardinal Law still free in Italy, why would Benedict expect that the Belgian authorities would act any differently?

    I think that the abject failure of the authorities in many countries to deal with these scandals when they learned of them is almost as shameful as the conduct of the priests who committed the abuse and the bishops who covered it up and enabled it. Good on Belgium for going against the trend.

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    Default Re: Belgian Criminals

    Ah, oh wise and waddling.

    "I think that the abject failure of the authorities in many countries to deal with these scandals when they learned of them is almost as shameful as the conduct of the priests who committed the abuse and the bishops who covered it up and enabled it. Good on Belgium for going against the trend."

    I never even thought of it that way. Well said.
    " Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? "
    - Epicurus

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    Default Re: Belgian Criminals

    I think it's one of the aspects of this whole thing that's tended to be overlooked. In many cases, the police were complicit in the cover-up as well.

    One of the things that the Ryan Report into the abuse scandal in Ireland brought to light was the negligent way that the police handled many reports of abuse. The problem wasn't just that the churches kept the facts of crimes from the authorities; the problem was also that the authorities themselves often deferred to Church "authority".

    The police had plenty of regular reports of abuse, but in many cases, what would happen was that when the family of an abused child went to the police, the police would then in turn go to the local bishop and ask him to investigate the allegations. Sometimes, they'd even hand the police case files over to him.

    I think that incidents like this are a big part of why the bishops and cardinals who participated in these cover-ups haven't been brought to justice to a greater degree: because to do that would mean exposing the whole, nasty mess that the police forces themselves have gotten themselves entangled in as well. It'd be difficult enough for a police detective to build a case against a well-regarded local archbishop; it makes it orders of magnitude more difficult to build a case against that archbishop when building that case would implicate the detective's own captain as well.

    This whole episode has been something that's convinced me even more of the imperative need for secularism in government and public institutions. We know that the abuse scandal didn't just happen because of a few predators who managed to get in the priesthood, but it also didn't just happen because of corruption within the Church itself. What happened could not have gone on for as long as it did without a cozy relationship between church and state - that's the thing that allowed the Catholic Church to "short circuit" the mechanisms we have in place to catch criminals, bring them to justice, and protect society.

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    Senior Member choSenfroZen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Belgian Criminals

    I think you are correct, the complicity of these crimes spreads around rather thickly. There is another
    story that is just beginning as well. The US feds want to talk to Ratzi, a lawsuit filed
    states :
    “unequivocal links to Pope Benedict XVI, formerly Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, to child sexual abuse cases in the United States,” proving that the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith on his watch “discouraged prosecution of accused clergy and encouraged secrecy to protect the reputation of the church.”

    The pope, McMurry argued, “is the most knowledgeable living person” regarding files in the Vatican and policies imposed by the Vatican on the sexual abuse crisis."

    Of course they are now circling their wagons, claims of soveriegn state status. They say it would be like demanding a deposition from the president.
    " Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? "
    - Epicurus

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    Default Re: Belgian Criminals

    Quote Originally Posted by choSenfroZen View Post
    Of course they are now circling their wagons, claims of soveriegn state status. They say it would be like demanding a deposition from the president.
    What a load of baloney. Presidents of state-owned corporations, which I'd say is more analogous to the Pope's actual role even if we give Vatican City WAY more weight than we probably should, don't get diplomatic immunity.

    However, now that I think about it, maybe we should let the Vatican have their way on this issue. If the Catholic Church is its own country, then that presumably means that we can treat pedophile priests and the bishops who cover them up as foreign diplomats... and expel them to Vatican City.

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    Default Re: Belgian Criminals

    Thats funny, but the Vatican probably would not want them, it would put the alter boys into way to much work,
    they would have to get diddled by the locals and all those voracious newcommers. Those poor boys would be all worn out and not able to sing.
    " Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? "
    - Epicurus

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    Default Re: Belgian Criminals

    In a brief to the Supreme Court filed May 21, Neal Kumar Katyal, who is acting solicitor general, said the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals erred in finding that the Holy See could be held vicariously liable for sexual abuse committed by a priest because he arguably could be considered an employee of the Vatican.

    The Obama administration was asked by the Supreme Court to weigh in on whether the court should accept the case of Holy See v. John Doe, in which an Oregon man seeks to hold the Vatican financially responsible for his sexual abuse by a priest in the 1960s. A decision about whether the court will hear the case could come before the court adjourns in late June or once it resumes work in the fall.

    A second case involving a similar effort to sue the Holy See is progressing through a U.S. District Court in Kentucky, where motions filed by the Vatican's U.S. attorney May 17 argue that the court lacks jurisdiction in the matter.

    In the Kentucky case, James O'Bryan, Donald Poppe and Michael Turner want to hold the Vatican liable for actions by bishops in failing to prevent sexual abuse by priests. They argue that the bishops who supervised the abusive priests were employees of the Holy See.

    Writing about the Oregon case, Katyal's brief dissected the 9th Circuit and lower court rulings. The 9th Circuit held that the unidentified plaintiff, Doe, had "sufficiently alleged" that the late Father Andrew Ronan, "was an employee of the Holy See acting within the 'scope of his employment' under Oregon law," and that his actions "can be attributed to the Holy See for jurisdictional purposes."

    From The Catholic Daily News
    " Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? "
    - Epicurus

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